|
|
Post by braniffops on Apr 8, 2008 22:49:46 GMT -5
Hey Guys,
I'm working on a text listing of the American Airlines December, 1974 schedule, but I'm running into a routing issue.
I figure that there were some western routes that the airline didn't have route authority on yet, one of those being the Honolulu flights. My issue is with flights 151 (westbound) and flight 152 (the eastbound return). The schedule shows both flights as 1-stop.
My question is...where did they stop?
|
|
|
|
Post by richardegtd on Apr 9, 2008 5:13:41 GMT -5
Regret don't have the '74 schedules but in '72 the routings were:
AA151: BOS-NYC-STL-HNL
AA152: HNL-STL
and in '77 -
AA151: NYC-STL-SFO-HNL
AA152: HNL-SFO-STL-NYC
Don't know if that helps or not ?!
Richard.
|
|
|
|
Post by chrisP on Apr 9, 2008 5:20:06 GMT -5
Hi, Dan!
From my Summer 1974 AA flightplans (and matching TT):
152: HNL-STL-JFK
151: JFK-STL-HNL
eqp is 707
fyi, I've got the 721, 722, 701, 703B, 703C, D10 and 747.
Exit runway when able
Christian
|
|
|
|
Post by braniffops on Apr 9, 2008 8:07:33 GMT -5
Right... But the a/c actually stopped between STL and HNL without dropping off passengers...that's the stop I'm looking for. I'm thinking LAX, but I can't verify that. It's the same premise as Braniff with the flights out of Acapulco, that go through Mexico City, but don't reflect stop that in the TT.  |
|
|
|
Post by bobh on Apr 9, 2008 8:53:24 GMT -5
Hi,
Looked flight up in my 1973 OAG and the stop appears to be in Hawaii.
AA151 listed as from STL to ITO, Days:567 leaving at 12:00 and arriving at 17:41.
AA152 from ITO to STL, Days:567 leaving at 16:37 and arriving at 18:00 (all times local)
Aircraft type listed as Boeing 320 fanjet.
Hope this helps.
Bob
|
|
|
|
Post by braniffops on Apr 9, 2008 9:31:56 GMT -5
That would make sense, as Hilo is not listed anywhere in the timetable.  |
|
|
|
Post by Christian Page, RAI on Apr 9, 2008 12:05:10 GMT -5
I'd go with Bob on this one, since I've see that the OAGs often list the individual legs not shown in timetables. That's not always the case, as with CO, 1973, which does not list a PDX leg to Hawaii.
|
|
|
|
Post by braniffops on Apr 9, 2008 12:25:14 GMT -5
Ya gotta love legs where the carrier can't carry local traffic...it makes deciphering the schedules that much more interesting... |
|
|
|
Post by Christian Page, RAI on Apr 9, 2008 15:16:30 GMT -5
Ya gotta love legs where the carrier can't carry local traffic...it makes deciphering the schedules that much more interesting... Indeed. Some can be deciphered by just looking at other cities - like Braniff's ACA-DFW service since they had ACA-DFW and MEX-DFW authority, just not ACA-MEX so in the Spring, 1975 timetable you see the flight as 1-stop ACA-DFW, but no mention of where the stop is. But when I looked under MEX, there was a MEX-DFW non-stop carrying the same number. Some of the LAD flights are like that as well, like SFO-LAX-LIM where SFO-LAX is not listed, but SFO-LIM and LAX-LIM are. But I guess if it was listed any other way, agents would have had to deal with irates yelling "Why can't I get a ticket to Los Angeles from San Francisco, you idiots fly the route, it says right here!" Never underestimate the power of ignorance and assumption - like one lady I witnessed that threw a fit at a WN agent because she wanted to go to Tulsa, so why was she in Oklahoma City? Apparently she thought Tulsa was the only place one would go when travelling to Oklahoma and the fact that Oklahoma City has its own airport and is two hours from Tulsa's by land never occurred to her. The ultimate irony was this was either May or June of 1995, and what little thing happened in that April that just might have been mentioned once or twice on TV? Or the person who called me screaming about canceling their AOL account when I was working for Inter.net? I swear, she called information and demanded the number of the "Internet", and the operator gave her ours because, well is looks like it - never mind the dot... |
|
|
|
Post by Andy on Apr 9, 2008 18:13:27 GMT -5
I would have guessed Hilo, too, but it was not. According to my July 1974 OAG, AA 151 was JFK-STL-SFO-HNL and 152 was the reverse. SFO was the intermediate stop between STL and HNL and vice verse. Authority was not given between SFO and HNL because it lists the STL-HNL leg as 1-stop but there is no AA flight in the SFO-HNL listing.
Apparently, they were also not authorized for STL-SFO traffic.
|
|
|
|
Post by chrisP on Apr 9, 2008 18:31:56 GMT -5
(sigh) no wonder they grounded their MD80s  |
|
|
|
Post by Christian Page, RAI on Apr 9, 2008 19:42:39 GMT -5
That's still a nightmare - 138 flights at ORD cancelled today. But, I bet Tulsa is getting plenty of overtime work |
|
|
|
Post by braniffops on Apr 9, 2008 20:42:35 GMT -5
And the folks at O'Hare are working overtime trying to finds homes for all those passengers. Thank God I'm off today. BTW, Andy...what was the layover time at SFO for those flights? |
|
|
|
Post by Andy on Apr 10, 2008 12:43:45 GMT -5
Sorry, there's no way I can figure the layover time. Since AA was not authorized for passengers STL-SFO or SFO-HNL on this flight, there is no listing of those separate segments. The only reason I know the technical stop is SFO is that the itinerary listing in the front of the OAG shows the routing JFK-STL-SFO-HNL. My guess is 30-45 minutes. They certainly refueled and probably changed flight crews. It was a 707-320 series with no change of equipment.
|
|
|
|
Post by chrisP on Apr 10, 2008 13:56:48 GMT -5
As a comparison basis, PA817 flew 707s in '74 SAN-HNL, NON-STOP, 09:00-12:20 (local times). Any difference in flight duration with your AAs would be the layover time.
|
|
